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 Post subject: Masurbation?
 Post Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2009 10:45 pm 
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Anyone know anything about abstaining from masturbation for initiation? What do shamans and their views on masturbation? Yeah, I know random question, but I recently talked to a "shaman" claiming that I had to abstain from masturbation in order to follow the path of a shaman.


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 Post Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 4:56 am 
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Location: Finland
Intresting question... While certain deciplene is needed to achieve anything, the question about abstaining may carry more cultural tradition than absolut truth.

If spirits come and take you, I think it same what you do, they come and take you and boil you however.

All, who I know and have any resemblance experience to shamanic initiation - devoured, eaten by spirits - did not even think about initiation at the time. So, I think they lwere living their life ordinary way, they were used to.

But for example inuit cultures may have had very strict code, how to prepare one, who is suspected to be called by spirits, they have strict diet, may not talk some period of time. But that is for one, who is called by spirits by illness or other way to prepare him to be shaman of tribe.


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 Post Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 6:39 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 11:26 am
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Location: Bavaria, Germany
Depends on what kind of initiation you have in mind.

This question never came up in my own life, neither in many others I know that do shamanizing, be it that they were being called or not. Sexuality is something natural, so the question arise why one should abstain from something natural in the first place. That is a cultural or ethnic question, not one of shamanism per se.

Yours,

Apu Kuntur


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 Post Posted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 3:22 pm 
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Joined: Sat Sep 12, 2009 11:19 pm
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If I drink too much, I should refrain of harming my integrety.

If I eat too much I should refrain (control) what is harming my integrity (self worth)

If I talk too much (i should refrain from talking....

WAIT....that's ME!!!!
of got to go!!! I'm talking waaay ttoooo muchh

don't need a shaman to tell me that


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 Post Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 11:28 am 
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Location: NW UK
I think it may well have to do with vital energy or Kundalini which rises up the energy centres, starting at the groin area. Abstaining from sexual activity is common amongst many initiatory systems in order to preserve vital energy and learn how to conduct such energy appropriately instead of releasing it in sexual arousal/orgasm. Likewise, other forms of abstinance are observed too such as strict diet, drink, drugs, types of work, when and where one sleeps etc.


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 Post Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 2:08 pm 
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OHHHHH...I get it....silly me I thought it just had to do with self control....
I have soooo much to learn............
THANK YOU


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 Post Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2009 8:05 am 
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Joined: Thu Oct 30, 2008 11:27 pm
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Location: Cedar Park, TX 78613
Initiations are not general their specific,this initiation is specific for you personally,in your personal initiation if this is the hardest thing you have to overcome,no pun intended,then count yourself lucky,however I believe that it is just the beginning for you,good luck and bless your teacher.


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 Post subject: Re: Masurbation?
 Post Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2009 4:02 am 
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metazen wrote:
Anyone know anything about abstaining from masturbation for initiation? What do shamans and their views on masturbation? Yeah, I know random question, but I recently talked to a "shaman" claiming that I had to abstain from masturbation in order to follow the path of a shaman.



Very interesting theme. The main thing - actual. :lol:



____________________________
sell online
route management


Last edited by terry3111 on Thu Dec 31, 2009 8:50 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 12:07 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2008 7:34 am
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Location: New Mexico
I had a cute little doctor once who told me to quit masturbating. I asked her why and she said, "I'm trying to examine you!"


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 Post Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 11:31 pm 
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Joined: Mon Apr 14, 2008 9:35 pm
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Location: Stafford Springs ,CT US
Sorry but I could not pass this one up :D . I thought we were past this area? If you are a Shaman, God, medicine man, etc. Why are you listening to this silly mind now body control!! Think about what you asked? If anyone or anything tells you to do something or not to do something stay away from the source. You my friend have alll the answers within!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! JimLOL :shock:


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 Post Posted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 10:42 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 22, 2009 10:23 am
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Location: UK
Thank-you for drawing our attention to this important topic, metazen! It also raises the important question of what kind of partnered sexual activity might best help, or seriously sabotage, the path and purposes of a shamanic practitioner.

Following The Path [as opposed to Losing Our Way], takes energy so we cannot afford to waste it. Shamanic practitioners also need both inner and outer power [energy] to bring their teaching and healing potential to the world.

TO ABSTAIN OR NOT?
Sexual activity, for men especially, releases an intense amount of energy and there is a lot of ancient wisdom around how to conserve, harness and transform this potency. Forest Child mentions how useful transformed sexual energy can be in awakening the higher chakras, for example. As has been mentioned, abstinence is not always healthy if it is based on denial/repression of natural healthy sexual self-expression, as opposed to genuine energy-transformation practices. There is also the potential for sexual energy/activity to directly progress spiritual development and altered consciousness, as in TANTRIC SEXUAL PRACTICES.

MASTURBATION - WHAT A WASTE!
Many of us dissipate our sexual energy thro lack of wisdom and skill in how we use it. There is no quicker way to waste potency than through masturbation. Excessive ejaculation is also a good way to drain the body of essential micronutrients, especially zinc [low zinc levels can be a factor in the progression of depression, which in turn can lead to more masturbation - for self-comfort - and more loss of zinc resulting in a very vicious downward spiral of low energy and physical tension driven by insecurity and anxiety i.e. masturbation can become addictive and in a variety of ways - self-sabotaging.

Like the ancients, I do not see this as a moral matter, but a practical and logical one. Sexual energy is a natural, healthy gift that we can invest wisely in nourishing and self-fulfilling experiences [be they sexual or non-sexual] or we can squander in neurotic or low-impulse-control activities - alone or with a partner.

CONSERVATON OF SEMEN
In Chinese Medicine it is recommended that men, particularly as they get older, "conserve their semen" thro separating orgasm and ejaculation [while having sex with a "yin-source" partner]. Most people think that for men, orgasm and ejaculation are inseparable, but this is only a reflection of general ignorance and lack of training. Even on those occasions when ejaculation occurs, we can get more out of it if we graduate from "held-in", localised orgasmic experience to the "whole-body orgasm", which has a much more powerfully refreshing and tension-releasing effect on the body. The path for this being a measure of holistic approach to the relationship plus a measure of self-control combined with some healing and personal development [lifestyle] work on releasing chakra blocks, if needed.

LOW-QUALITY PARTNERED SEX
Low-quality partnered sex [e.g. where a woman lies passively thinking about her shopping list!] is little better than masturbation, from an energetic point of view. Good sex is where there is an EXCHANGE OF ENERGY, so that neither partner is depleting themself.

Actually, particularly where opposite genders are involved, there is a potential for ENERGETIC SYNERGY i.e. for the combined exchanged energies to be more powerful than the sum of the individual energy investments. This happens when one partner has an excess of yin energy and the other has an excess of yang energy. In this situation, the exchange results in a re-balancing/wholeness of the energy systems of both people - balanced yin/yang energy is generally more effective for goal-achieving, relationships, health and wellbeing, than an excess of yin or yang.

For anyone wishing to get the most out of their sexual energy and experiences, I would heartily recommend this manual...

"The Tao of Health, Sex and Longevity"


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 12:10 am 
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Joined: Mon Apr 14, 2008 9:35 pm
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Location: Stafford Springs ,CT US
Hello my brothers and sisters, I can't pass this one up either! My Brother Michael I'm sure it was just a miss type when you said especially men. I have to give you my truth about MEN and WOMEN. A women's sexual (energy) release is just as intense as a man's. And in some women that I witnessed was alot more powerful than alot of men. So I would not have generalized the activity because we are all one :D Jim C


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 Post Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 8:39 am 
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Joined: Wed Apr 22, 2009 10:23 am
Posts: 120
Location: UK
Hi Foolshawk,

Quote:
A women's sexual (energy) release is just as intense as a man's.

There are 2 points here. The first is that only men release semen, which is much more energy-rich than the sexual fluids of women. In fact semen is intensely rich in energy in the form of the chemicals which make up the spermatozoa themselves [they are incredible "power houses", rich in enzymes to break down their high-energy reserves and facilitate their journey up the female genital tract]. Plus the seminal fluids contain energy rich nutrients AND the hormone prostaglandin which acts on the woman's genital tract.

The second point is that, whether we like it, or not, "climaxing" is generally less common in women than in men.

Hence my comment that "for men especially", wise use of sexual energy is very important.

SEXUAL ENERGY DEPLETION & HEALTH
It intrigues me that the ancient Chinese medicine [Taoist] teachings on sexual energy management give symptoms of "sexual energy depletion" which are the same as the symptoms of HIV infection. The HIV epidemic was of course originally nurtured, came to prominence [no pun intended!], and was at its most devastating in a U.S. gay community where there was rampant promiscuous sexual activity between men. Are non-vaginal sexual practices more risky for energy depletion [less efficient energy-exchange] and yinyang balance problems than vaginal intercourse?

SEXUAL ENERGY AND THE JOURNEY FROM DUALITY TO COSMIC ONENESS
Sexual energy does seem to be very potent in accessing transcendent, altered-state-of-consciousness spiritual experiences, as an array of manuals and videos on Tantric Sex bear witness.


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 2:50 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 11:26 am
Posts: 181
Location: Bavaria, Germany
Hello Brothermichael,

regarding the Chinese ideas on all this: We are living in a world with really good food, which was not the case in ancient China for the most people there. Living only on rice is not that nuturing and thus wasting energy and minerals was a big problem.

As long as you are eating with consciousness you have enough minerals and proteins available to replace the loss of semen.

Obviously you refer to Mantak Chiahs Tao Yoga teachings.

Yours,

Apu Kuntur


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 Post Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:25 am 
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Joined: Mon Apr 14, 2008 9:35 pm
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Location: Stafford Springs ,CT US
Hello Brothermichael and Apu Kuntur, You guys are both right I was thinking about the subject in a different way, I respect both of your opinions and for me I feel very lucky that spirit directed me to this portal ! I have learned and have looked at many things in different ways because of your brilliant post's!! Many Thanks !!!!!!! Jim C


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