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 Post subject: Can a Shaman talk too much?
 Post Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 1:59 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2008 1:49 pm
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Location: Portsmouth, NH USA
I experienced a Temezcalli last night and the Shaman never stopped talking. Even when he requested intentions for loved ones, or later for changes in the world, he talked incessantly on how and/or why these intentions were to originate.

What is the protocal for a Temezcalli? Isn't some silence a prerequisite given the noise of the world? How can we connect with the energy of everything and everyone with continual babble?

Thank you for setting me straight.


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 Post Posted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 8:29 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2007 4:23 pm
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Location: Euclid, OH
Interesting that this is the first time I have come across this posting!

Can a Shaman talk too much!?? What an amazing question that is!

My first reaction after reading your posting was...hmmm...perhaps this teacher was caught up in his personality/ego.

Or perhaps, there was more going on than you really understood with your rational mind/intellect!

I have known ones who, through speaking, will, through the sounds and intonations of their voices, help induce such a state in a student that it makes them "come out of their heads" and stop "thinking". Since most of us who are "westernized" to some extent (those of us who live in this "western"-type society of business and commerce) tend to be "in our heads" way too much! Perhaps the idea wasn't so much to listen to his words and try to comprehend them -- perhaps the idea was to use the voice as a "white noise" to bring others OUT of their thinking/rational minds???

Crowtalker


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 Post subject: Crowtalker: thank you for your reply
 Post Posted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 10:51 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2008 1:49 pm
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Location: Portsmouth, NH USA
Crowtalker:

Thank you for your reply and insight. My first, second, third and fourth thought during the sweat was it was the Shaman's ego. Then, I realized the thoughts I was having were mine, when I inquired "for whom has this thought arisen?" - the answer is of course, "for me", it is my thought. This of course begs the question, "who am I?" and the answer is I am Being, the energy within me that watches the mind. Although I have done this inquiry hundreds of times in the midst of the noise of "the world", I found while the Shaman was asking insightful questions, he did not pause long enough between the questions to allow an inquiry. Perhaps his method worked on the others as you suggested. For me, the stillness of the space between the breaths is a much more powerful "voice". Thank you for being you. Michael www.thenowsound.net mshingleton@earthlink.net


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 Post Posted: Fri Nov 07, 2008 7:53 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2007 4:23 pm
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Location: Euclid, OH
Yes, the space in between the breaths is also important to me.

Perhaps, in a round about way, whether it was intended by the Shaman or not, the lesson did get through to some, eh?

I know how difficult it is for people to learn to sit in silence. I know how difficult it was for me at one time!

Thank you for your response; it made me smile and remember things, this early morning.

Hau. :)

CT


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 Post Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2009 8:17 pm 
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A shaman should be balanced between speaking and listening. One of a shaman’s greatest attributes should be his ability to listen.


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 Post Posted: Mon May 11, 2009 4:06 pm 
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Location: Madrid
I think that's a pretty good question that I've finally answered to myself during part of the learning / improvement period I've been through this year (still on the way, but at least some of my essential questions have been answered).

Definitely I think one of the most important roles for a shaman is, even though he's requested to answer a question after the other, not to talk too much, and to give only the required or necessary information: for this you need to watch, listen, feel and analyse, and then, ultimately, speak, but being some kind of 'cog' in the situation, in the machinery of the Universe, the whole thing happening, but leaving unnecesary things unspoken so:

A) Mystery is preserved as a sacred thing in a way that the Shaman feels a kind of enigmatic/respectful sympathy for the sources of Mystery (and viceversa). Discretion is essential
B) Let people decide on themselves as much as they can about the subject, thus the Shaman has to intervene merely as a 'connector' of ideas or a guide for those people that feel lost or confused, giving them the tools to disentangle their emotions or mental concepts, but not doing that work for them.

Otherwise, the Shaman is at risk of becoming some kind of Messiah instead of, simply (in some ocassions), a Messenger. To me that was one of the hardest parts in the process of self-improvement: to restrain talking only for the joy of it. If you appreciate this there comes a point in which you realise you dominate your feelings instead of the opposite. For a Shaman and his people is absolutly essential to be some kind of 'mind over matter' entity rather than an emotive one


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 Post Posted: Mon May 11, 2009 10:37 pm 
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Joined: Mon Apr 14, 2008 9:35 pm
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Location: Stafford Springs ,CT US
Bhagawan, I think that if during the Temezcalli you were thinking that the Shaman was talking to much than this is about you and why this bothered you. With respect the question is N/A. A Shaman at any ceremony if he feels that certain people need to hear things over and over again than he was trying to help those people. Did you learn or get anything out of the ceremony? Maybe a little patience? Perhaps you should hold your own Temezcalli and get a little taste of all the ego's and spiritual problems that shamans feel even before a ceremony starts. If you were the only person during the ceremony than maybe you would have been right. But step back and take in everything around you and maybe you would have had a different exsperiance? A shaman can talk tell he passes out. Or not at all if he feels that is needed. So no a Shaman can't talk to much :D Foolshawk


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 Post Posted: Tue May 12, 2009 4:44 pm 
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Location: Canada
I think most folks talk too much, so much emphasis on the spoken word, of course I am deaf so that is my biased opinion! :wink:


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 4:19 am 
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Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2007 6:50 am
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Location: Pennsylavania
Each shaman has their brand of medicine. Some talk more some talk less. Some not at all. Having command of both is pretty essential.

Try practicing "listening with absolute presence." Very very few can do this, but when working with people it is essential. (I should open up a topic solely on this one)

A side note might be that this time that person had more to share.


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 Post Posted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 1:52 pm 
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Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2008 4:58 pm
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Location: Central Texas, USA
Interesting that this topic came back up at this time. I recently came a question related to "having a voice." The premise of the question was something along the lines of - "lots of people work hard to be heard in the world, then they are finally heard, then they realize they no longer need to talk. Is there a time, when these same people will feel the need to speak again?" .... sorry, I'm not doing the question justice.....

Anyway, thing that struck me about one of the answers was perspective. One answer said, "when your point of view about "I" and "We" changes, then you come to realize that you have always been talking."

Just a thought. Sorry this doesn't answer the question.

Peace


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