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 Post subject: Shamanic Initiation, Death, Baron Samedi, and Psychompomp
 Post Posted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 4:29 pm 
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Hello all; I'm new to shamanism in general. I'm very interested in acquiring shamanic knowledge to augment my own natural abilities in psychic protection, healing, divination and visions. My interests range through nearly all the old cultures that had shamans; Native Americas, Ojibwes, Obeahs and Hoodoo practitioners of west and central Africa, Aztec priests (I believe they're called nahuatls or nahuitls), Celtic shamans and Druids, as well was the Inuit people of Alaska and regions near Russia, Tibetan buddhists, Indian yogis, Hmong shamans, Australian aboriginees, and the Volva shaman women of the Nordic traditions. These also represent mythologies and pantheons that I have varying degrees of direct knowledge or experience with. I've practiced magic for eight years.

But I've never been able to meet or talk with anyone who can help me undergo a shamanic initiation and death ritual. I understand I must do these things in order to obtain the knowledge I seek. I am not trying or willing to interact with deities of any kind in order to obtain knowledge, as is common for young people interested in magic. They take the easy path and suffer; I want to take the right road, the hard road, to gain the knowledge. I have other concerns and thoughts regardng this initiation as well.

I understand that death symbolism is a common theme in the rituals. I want to undergo it in the safest way possible. Since Baron Samedi is the death lord in Hoodoo traditions, must I build some kind of rapport with or appease him, in order to achieve a symbolic death? I also understand that shamans sometimes travel to a place that many call the Underworld, if need be. In such a place, would shamanic weapons be necessary? Which brings me to symbolic weapons; I know they are made during the shamanic path. Must they be actually physical? It's just that I have no knowledge of woodworking or metallurgy. I'd prefer to "craft" weapons of energy, so that I might use them if need be during a psychic assault.

Lastly, I know that shamanism does not have a dichotomy per se, but that there are practitioners of a darker path in many traditions, such as in Hoodoo, they are called bokor. Many are attracted to Obeah in particular because of its sheer "dark" power. I'd pefer to avoid such a path, but I don't think that so many are attracted to it simply because it's "dark." If there are an Obeah practitioners on this forum, is there any kind of "secret" knowledge isolated to Obeah that one cannot find in another path, or is it simply another form of chaos magic? I've read about that, too.


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 Post subject: Re: Shamanic Initiation, Death, Baron Samedi, and Psychompom
 Post Posted: Wed May 25, 2011 11:15 am 
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Joined: Sat Feb 21, 2009 3:35 pm
Posts: 301
Location: Finland
Here is so much information about different cultures, that whole idea becomes a bit obscure. What it is, that is really seek and why? Every culture has it's own procedures, rituals, gods so there is no such thing as common/general shamanic way. It is true,that Harner combined his own method from loaning different shamic cultures, but usually people follow, what their elders/teachers tell, whether those are spirits or people.

I have not heard any single positive word about initiation/death ritual build because of human mind/will. Initiation will come, if it is meant to. There is great number less serious topics of psychic fields to play around. It is no wonder nobody wants to help single individual to undergo things asked. Expecially, because it is not in power of humans to provide shamanic initiation at first place, that is between spirit and the one spirits have decided to heat up and cook. And even then there is not much choices, whether that human wants to be cooked or not.

If you ask humans to do that, you have wrong address.


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 Post subject: Re: Shamanic Initiation, Death, Baron Samedi, and Psychompom
 Post Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2011 7:36 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jun 21, 2011 9:36 am
Posts: 7
Kylaen wrote:
Hello all; I'm new to shamanism in general. I'm very interested in acquiring shamanic knowledge to augment my own natural abilities in psychic protection, healing, divination and visions. My interests range through nearly all the old cultures that had shamans; Native Americas, Ojibwes, Obeahs and Hoodoo practitioners of west and central Africa, Aztec priests (I believe they're called nahuatls or nahuitls), Celtic shamans and Druids, as well was the Inuit people of Alaska and regions near Russia, Tibetan buddhists, Indian yogis, Hmong shamans, Australian aboriginees, and the Volva shaman women of the Nordic traditions. These also represent mythologies and pantheons that I have varying degrees of direct knowledge or experience with. I've practiced magic for eight years.

But I've never been able to meet or talk with anyone who can help me undergo a shamanic initiation and death ritual. I understand I must do these things in order to obtain the knowledge I seek. I am not trying or willing to interact with deities of any kind in order to obtain knowledge, as is common for young people interested in magic. They take the easy path and suffer; I want to take the right road, the hard road, to gain the knowledge. I have other concerns and thoughts regardng this initiation as well.

I understand that death symbolism is a common theme in the rituals. I want to undergo it in the safest way possible. Since Baron Samedi is the death lord in Hoodoo traditions, must I build some kind of rapport with or appease him, in order to achieve a symbolic death? I also understand that shamans sometimes travel to a place that many call the Underworld, if need be. In such a place, would shamanic weapons be necessary? Which brings me to symbolic weapons; I know they are made during the shamanic path. Must they be actually physical? It's just that I have no knowledge of woodworking or metallurgy. I'd prefer to "craft" weapons of energy, so that I might use them if need be during a psychic assault.

Lastly, I know that shamanism does not have a dichotomy per se, but that there are practitioners of a darker path in many traditions, such as in Hoodoo, they are called bokor. Many are attracted to Obeah in particular because of its sheer "dark" power. I'd pefer to avoid such a path, but I don't think that so many are attracted to it simply because it's "dark." If there are an Obeah practitioners on this forum, is there any kind of "secret" knowledge isolated to Obeah that one cannot find in another path, or is it simply another form of chaos magic? I've read about that, too.


No one can help you undergo a shamanic initiation or death ritual. The spirits themselves will decide and it will not be by any ritual. First they will test you to see if you have any ability what so ever to perceive them. They can not tell you the secrets of life or the universe or the secrets of healing and the future if you can not see them, sense them or understand them. To be a traditional shaman of ancient time is to have one foot in both worlds. To be both dead and alive at the same time and at will. No person "wants" to be a shaman of this realm as to do so means risk of loss of life. The shamanic path is much safer. Practicing meditation, self deprivation (loss of ego) and service to the community. These are all things that Jesus did.
If you wish to open yourself up to the world of spirits you must first remove yourself from the comforts of the flesh. Spending time completely alone, surrounded by nature and depriving one's self of certain things are roads that many Native American Shaman of past have walked down. These things make it easier to see the spiritual world, when all the noise around us no longer competes for there attention. Listen to the sound of the water in the brook, listen the trees in the wind. Look at the moon for a long time. Listen to your dreams. One of the ways's that the Spirits talk to us is through imagery. Pay attention to the pictures and images that pop up in your head. Pay attention to the symbols and messages in your dreams. These are the ways the spirits talk. They have no physical bodies to make sound with so it is only through charades and masquerades as archtypical figures that they can get through to us. This is a simplistic way to explain it but it is how it starts. If you are successful the initiation begins and you will literally see a parade of spirits one after the other teaching you and showing you. Hope this helps.


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 Post subject: Re: Shamanic Initiation, Death, Baron Samedi, and Psychompom
 Post Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2011 9:49 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2011 9:30 pm
Posts: 18
Location: Montreal
The fail in this thread...

I'll start by saying that of what I have read (Korean Shamanism -Muism by Kim Tae-Kon) the budding individual looking for initiation is dead on arrival. I didn't follow my path from being in happiness gumdrops and lollipops. It took extreme fatigue, ill health, and grief to be where I am today. And I didn't want any of that. It just happened. I feel born into this.
I would imagine that many charismatic shamans didn't choose their lifestyle so much as they tripped over it and settled down.

If you want initiation it can be done in your bathtub. Maybe bring some scuba gear and a trident.

That's how I attuned myself (a word I am adopting here from reiki). Only without any scuba gear nor a trident.

You're looking at this backwards. Like the magicians you criticize. You're seeing the symbols and the psychopomp instead of actually examining the simple ingredient that it takes to begin your journey...

grief.

lots of grief. empathy for other beings in grief too.

Otherwise why are you here.

Maybe stick to your Atmosfear boardgame and 90s occult works. Eat more words.

I apologize before anyone kills themselves I mean this I didn't mean to try to drown yourself. A bathtub is just a nice intimate space to meet your guides and ancestors. Its a natural place of introspection. For me made it easy to understand.


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