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Interview with Arbolita Pashak

Versions of this article appeared first of all in Sacred Hoop and Kindred Spirit magazines.

Arbolita Pashak is a Mexican healer from the state of San Luis Potosí in Mexico. She learnt here craft from her grandmother, and from her
ongoing work in the indigenous communities in Chiapas. She now works at the Centre of the Conscious Dream in the Sonora Desert. In this interview with Daniel Stone, who translates from the Spanish, she talks about her experience of shamans, the Mayans, and the end of time.

Could you tell us something about shamanism in Mexico?
What is shamanism? I don’t relate to this word. It is very academic, or intellectual. The ‘ism’‚ means that it is taken from something. It is taken from the word ‘shaman’. I have related to shamans. But they would not announce themselves ‘I am a shaman’. They are respected and important members of the community, but if they were sitting next to you, you probably would not know that you were sitting next to a real shaman! They are very humble people, and they are naguals, They connect with beings and spirits who are not human, but who are in communication with us, even if most are not aware of this.

What is a nagual?
A nagual is a being that is not restricted to one time and one space. The nagual can change form, and can move between times.

Does the word come from Carlos Castañeda1?
Naguals existed a long time before Carlos Castañeda, like shamans existed long before‘shamanism’.

Are the books of Carlos Castañeda describing something real?
He wrote good poetry.

So what is real?
There are many layers of reality. Most people stay on the level of the physical, or material, and this is fixed in one type of time and space. But there are many more layers of dimensions, dreams, because time is not fixed. It never really stays still. For the Maya, it is a spiral.

The 26,000 year Mayan calendar ends in 2011 - 12. Is this the end of time?
It is a metaphorfor the end of time, and for some, it will be the end of their time here, on a certain level. There are doorways which are being opened right now, which enable people who have been waiting for generations, to move into another dimension, which have different time and space rules. For these people, this time is crucial, and really all their energy should be given to being as conscious as possible. But most people will continue as before.

So how can one know if one is ready to move through this doorway?
Those that know have no doubt. They have been waiting to do this, although there are some that are ready but are not conscious, but they will be getting some big surprises. Also, I should add, that although some will chose to transform on all levels, I am not talking about a mass death exodus! We can operate on
different levels at the same time. We can move through this dimension, and our bodies and personalities can complete their process here as well. We are multi-dimensional beings.

So there are those that are naturally called to do this kind of work?
Yes, like there are those who are naturally incarnated into a particular task. These are the rules of destiny.

Destiny is a difficult idea to understand.
It is not an idea, it is a reality.

Ok, could you tell us more?
Destiny is like a river, you can swim with it, or you can swim against it, or you can float. Either way, you will arrive at the sea, but what you do in the river of destiny will determine which state you arrive in.

And then - in the sea?
This is an analogy for the transformation into another dream. The portal we are talking about here in 2012 is a kind of death. The planet is dying, but this is a cause of celebration, not dread. It is transforming, and we are transforming with it. We cross the sea of time, like we gradually transform, or merge into our next
dream. You do not need to die to do this, you can travel through your dreaming body.

You say that 2012 only affects those who are ready, but surely the transformation of the planet affects us all.
Yes. Both are true. Everyone - consciously or unconsciously – is doing something for this transformation. Even Tony Blair is doing something which is part of this transformation. The wars – all of this is part of the process.

So what are those to do who do not go through this doorway and stay on the transforming planet?
Help it die, like they can help themselves to die. Be the midwives, even if they are men. Eventually, all will transform, but each being has their sense of timing. Each being has the sense of the right time to die.

What is the dreaming body?
It is the body of dreams. It does not obey the same rules as the physical body. Through the dreaming body you can move through time, and space. You can enter other dreams, other dimensions. So through the dreaming body, you can pass over the other side, you can learn about death, and then you will lose your fear. Most fears come from the fear of dying. But we are dying every second of the day.

So have you experienced your own death?
Yes. It is like being in love.

So why don’t you just die now?
Because there is work. Those that are open to the different dimensions can offer this experience to other beings – not just humans, beings of all kinds who are longing to learn how to transform, to move on, to die very beautifully. To live very beautifully. It is the same thing. Unfortunately, most of the ceremonies of death have been lost, and there are many beings who are wandering around without a body and without a clue. A lot of our work is with beings who do not have a body.

And you chose the desert in the North to do this, even though your communities are more in the South?
Where we are in the North, at the end of the Huricuta pilgrimage route, is a natural inter-dimensional vortex where the theories of the Maya can be felt and experienced in practice. It is a place that attracts a lot of beings who are ready to die. To dance into transformation. You can feel and live the spiral of time.

Is this useful?
(She laughs). For those who want to stay in the material level, no. For those who are ready to shift, it is gold.

Do you have anything else to add?
Forget ‘shamanism’, and forget ‘shaman’. Look at the universe inside and outside of yourself. Open to the mystery. Plant things, trees, vegetables, and talk to them. They will make more sense than you or I ever could. Trees will teach you how to touch the universe, because their roots extend to the centre of the earth and their branches extend to the stars, to the universe. Through them you can breathe the universe. The human is much bigger than he or she appears to be. Everything is much bigger than it appears to be. It is all a matter of the doors of perception.

What are the doors of perception.
The way that the eyes change to see the difference between illusion and truth. This is something that can be learnt. There are many techniques. The base of it all is the opening of the ‘heart’. Learning the art of love means opening to communicate with all the energies that are conscious. It is not an easy journey. One would have to go to the places where the heart closed, the memories, the traumas. But until we go through them, we cannot breathe love, we cannot touch the universe, we cannot fly.

I fly in many of my dreams at night. Can I fly in the day?
If you change the way you see, and you work with your different bodies to sustain the level of attention, then yes.

Arbolita Pashak and Daniel Stone work at The Centre of The Conscious Dream in the Desert of San Luis Potosi, Mexico, and run courses also in the Europe and the U.S.

About the author:
Arbolita Pashak learnt through her native Mexican blood line the shamanic arts and intuitive healing. She has worked with many indigenous communitites with projects of sustainable development. She makes organic healing products, and teaches the ceremonial and healing use of Mexican plants and also the practical uses of the Mayan calender.
Daniel Stone has been developing shamanic dreaming circles for eleven years in Europe, the U.S. and Mexico. He founded The Shamanic School of Dreaming in 1996, and Centre of the Conscious Dream in Mexico in 2000. He is author of ’The shaman, the Buddha, and the conscious dream’ and is an international exhibiting artist.


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